Factorio - automate ALL the things!

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KnightExemplar
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Re: Factorio - automate ALL the things!

Postby KnightExemplar » Fri May 05, 2017 5:43 pm UTC

https://forums.factorio.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=46452

•Changed production science pack recipe to require assembling machine 1 instead of pumpjack.
•Changed science pack 3 to require electric mining drill instead of assembling machine 1.


Fuck. This would have made my life easier. But I'm well into High-Tech science now, and it'd be a pain to change my "starter base" to use these easier formulas. Fortunately, I'm in the middle of building my main base, and I haven't done my main-stage science yet. But my "Starter Base" is cranking away. I don't feel like redesigning my "starter base", but I'm many hours from getting a usable "main base".

I'll go for the new update only once my main-base is ready for science. But for now, I don't want to halt my science advancement due to the update.

raudorn wrote:The PA is finished and working quite fine.


You keep saying PA, and I hoped that I'd understand by now... does "PA" mean "Primary Area" ?? Or... something else? Very elegant base btw. It looks like you have a very well designed rail network, and I'm not seeing any obvious issues with your rail network design either.
First Strike +1/+1 and Indestructible.

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raudorn
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Re: Factorio - automate ALL the things!

Postby raudorn » Fri May 05, 2017 6:23 pm UTC

KnightExemplar wrote:
•Changed production science pack recipe to require assembling machine 1 instead of pumpjack.
•Changed science pack 3 to require electric mining drill instead of assembling machine 1.


Fuck.

Ha, yeah, that change came kinda out of left field. They filed it under balancing, so I guess they wanted to streamline the progression for new players even more and rebalance the iron/steel requirements.

KnightExemplar wrote:You keep saying PA, and I hoped that I'd understand by now... does "PA" mean "Primary Area" ?? Or... something else? Very elegant base btw. It looks like you have a very well designed rail network, and I'm not seeing any obvious issues with your rail network design either.

Thanks, it's a rail design that I think I saw on some stream, but can't remember where. It does have some flaws that make it a poor choice for a true RPM+ megabase, but for everything smaller I guess it's fine.

PA means production area. As far as I know it's not a term usually used in the factorio community, but I use it for the area where all the item get produced, that aren't meant for consumption in the further production of science or rocket parts. I guess "the shop" would be fitting too, since you walk in, order a bunch of stuff and bots bring it to you.

KnightExemplar
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Re: Factorio - automate ALL the things!

Postby KnightExemplar » Fri May 05, 2017 6:44 pm UTC

raudorn wrote:
KnightExemplar wrote:
•Changed production science pack recipe to require assembling machine 1 instead of pumpjack.
•Changed science pack 3 to require electric mining drill instead of assembling machine 1.


Fuck.

Ha, yeah, that change came kinda out of left field. They filed it under balancing, so I guess they wanted to streamline the progression for new players even more and rebalance the iron/steel requirements.


I agree with the changes. To get to my current point in my current map, I mined out ~4 different Iron Ore patches but only ~1 Copper patch. The new changes greatly reduce the Iron Ore consumption in the mid-game. Hmm, maybe I should update for my 0.15 run. The changes definitely make those late-game science packs cheaper overall.

KnightExemplar wrote:You keep saying PA, and I hoped that I'd understand by now... does "PA" mean "Primary Area" ?? Or... something else? Very elegant base btw. It looks like you have a very well designed rail network, and I'm not seeing any obvious issues with your rail network design either.

Thanks, it's a rail design that I think I saw on some stream, but can't remember where. It does have some flaws that make it a poor choice for a true RPM+ megabase, but for everything smaller I guess it's fine.

PA means production area. As far as I know it's not a term usually used in the factorio community, but I use it for the area where all the item get produced, that aren't meant for consumption in the further production of science or rocket parts. I guess "the shop" would be fitting too, since you walk in, order a bunch of stuff and bots bring it to you.


Yeah, I think more people call it "the store" or "the shop". I personally call it the store.

-------------

I've been trying to look at everyone's rail designs. I want to hit 1-Rocket per Minute (especially now that rockets generate science, and that infinite-science gives a real goal to march towards). But my experiments with railroads demonstrates that bottlenecks are very common, and that the 2-rail network with 1-2 trains has maybe ~3500 Ore per second limitation... at least... a 1-1 Train has a ~2000 Ore per Second limitation and I'm assuming 1-2 trains can handle slightly less than double.

I've tried to wrap my head around a 4-rail network (2-rails in both directions), but I don't quite understand the balancing or how the bottlenecks would evolve.

My current design is to have to separate rails networks. I've named the two networks "Outposts" and "Smithy". These are connected by a Logistic Network. I know that at Megabase size, Logistic Networks are bottlenecked by the charging stations of Roboports, but ~75 Logistic Bots per Roboport... plus a large scattering of Roboports + thousands of bots should be able to handle the load (famous last words anybody??).

I'm hoping that resolves the bottleneck issue when the base grows to megabase size. But I'm many hours away from being able to accomplish this and test the idea...
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CorruptUser
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Re: Factorio - automate ALL the things!

Postby CorruptUser » Mon Jul 23, 2018 3:36 am UTC

Got back into it since leaving a while back. So... much... to do...

SuicideJunkie
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Re: Factorio - automate ALL the things!

Postby SuicideJunkie » Mon Jul 23, 2018 8:51 pm UTC

Something I set up just last week, which is quite nice; Train based bus service.

1) At various places around the map, I've got a pair of adjacent stops.
a) One stop is named "Bus_Pickup"
b) The other stop is named "Bus_{locationDescription}"
2) The bus_pickup is wired to a wall segment and gate sensor, which enables the stop whenever you are standing nearby.
3) There are two 1-0-1 trains on the grid (single-track) acting as buses.
a) Bus one has a schedule of I) Visit Bus_Pickup, stay until Gate=0, II) Visit Bus_DepotInbound
b) Bus two has a schedule of I) Visit Bus_{locationDescription}, stay 15s II) Visit Bus_DepotOutbound, stay forever. Then it repeats (I) and (II) for all destinations.

So, the way this works, is:
You walk up to a bus stop and the gate triggers the inbound bus, which shows up within a few seconds.
When you board the bus, the gate closes, and the train immediately takes off for the depot.
Get out at the depot, and board the outbound bus.
Choose a destination to go-to on the outbound bus. Logistics bots will swarm you with mall deliveries while you decide.
Hop out when you arrive and run off to do stuff.
You don't have to worry about leaving the trains parked in inconvenient locations, and they never get lost like the car does.
No matter which stop you got off at, or how far you wander on foot, the nearest bus stop is always the correct one :)
And they're filled with rocket fuel, so they're super quick.

I'd put in nuclear fuel for stupidly-fast bus service, but the 1% energy efficiency is so horrifyingly bad that I can't justify it to myself despite having a ~6 million uranium ore stockpile. (1.21 GJ each, is the equivalent of just over 100 GJ if the ore is processed into fuel cells in the power plant instead)


Previous games, I had an Uber train, but having to call it in manually was sub-optimal and I was often just going back to the mall anyways.

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Quizatzhaderac
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Re: Factorio - automate ALL the things!

Postby Quizatzhaderac » Tue Sep 11, 2018 2:56 pm UTC

Just started playing a few days ago. Just rebuilt my factory to run off a memory sushi belt configured to produce whatever is in short supply. I'm glad I read the wiki, because I was about to attempt that before researching circuits (only filter feeders) which is a more involved solution.

I have yet to see any of the local mega-fauna. Default world generation.

My next big thing will be to go out and find an oilfield. Hopefully I'll be attacked in the process.
The thing about recursion problems is that they tend to contain other recursion problems.

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raudorn
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Re: Factorio - automate ALL the things!

Postby raudorn » Wed Sep 12, 2018 7:58 pm UTC

I'm surprised you haven't had a run-in with the biters yet. Usually they start attacking soon once you got a smelting and a power setup, though the starting area might simply be pollution-friendly, e.g. with lots of trees or a big lake.

As for the sushi belt, that's quite an advanced technique and while it's not usually used for more than proof-of-concept, it certainly beats the bowl of spaghetti everyone cooks with their first base. :D

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CorruptUser
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Re: Factorio - automate ALL the things!

Postby CorruptUser » Thu Sep 13, 2018 2:09 pm UTC

I set up my games with a very large starting area and no enemy expansion and rare but large resources (a custom version of rail world), so I don't see attacks until around the time I've got laser turrets. I do tend to exterminate a few nests around the time I set up oil production, but my factory needs to expand...

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Quizatzhaderac
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Re: Factorio - automate ALL the things!

Postby Quizatzhaderac » Thu Sep 13, 2018 5:46 pm UTC

There are a lot of trees around, maybe an abnormal amount. I did find enemies while looking for oil. There's a base of nine nests (and I've destroyed a few) right by the nearest oil field, with a worm that seems immune to shotgun damage.

I think I may have made a mistake setting up radar as earlier as I did. As I understand it, scanning a chunk causes it to be generated which starts the clock on base reproduction. My radar has detected a many bases within it's range.

A picked the sushi belt because it scales well with complexity, thus preparing me somewhat for the production of things I haven't learned about yet.
I was thinking in analogous terms of vertebrate circulatory systems where everything <-> blood, which is (in a way) simpler. My method of achieving feedback without a circuit network (which I didn't use) was based off of kidneys.

The system I currently have now has a green network doing hold read across my whole main belt.
My red network starts with constant combinators broadcasting the amounts of everything I want in the negative (if I want 40 iron bars on the belt, I broadcast -40).
Belts segments coming in from raw materials are connected to both networks, but don't read. They are activated if the amount for the resource I want is less than zero (the combined signal for both networks is howManyThereAre - howManyIWant).
Inserters feeding my assemblers work on that same logic. Each assembler is single purpose.
I have lights next to most assemblers and raw resource feeders on the same logic to show when work is going on. If the light is on a lot while the assembler isn't working I know I have a bottleneck.
I have a goodies chest/system designed to put certain numbers of certain things in a box, which I personally take whenever I want and get automatically replaced.
Last edited by Quizatzhaderac on Fri Sep 14, 2018 4:06 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.
The thing about recursion problems is that they tend to contain other recursion problems.

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CorruptUser
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Re: Factorio - automate ALL the things!

Postby CorruptUser » Fri Sep 14, 2018 2:55 am UTC

IIRC, the aliens start colonizing and such regardless of whether or not you scan the area.

SuicideJunkie
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Re: Factorio - automate ALL the things!

Postby SuicideJunkie » Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:32 pm UTC

I think the map operates a fixed distance out into the blackness. Scanning out further would activate more unscanned border tiles in that case, but overall the point remains that just because you can't see them, doesn't mean they're not there.

I started a Bobs + Angels game, and after a decent start I've slogged right down.
My little starter base is operating OK up to blue science, but my big efficiency expansion is killing me. I've got a big spaced out ore sorting & processing facility, that sends a train off to whatever ore patches it needs to pull from, and grinds out pure tier 1 & 2 ores to a huge line of train stations. (Iron through to silicon)
But those ores need a big smelting operation each to become plates efficiently, and I've only got Iron/Steel/ half copper out there.

I think I'm trying to reach too far on the long-process ore efficiency schemes. Haven't even got close to circuits on the outer base, and morale has fallen :).


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