Unnecessary SWAT Use

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jewish_scientist
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Unnecessary SWAT Use

Postby jewish_scientist » Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:56 pm UTC

I wanted to start this thread, because there seems to be a recent trend of SWAT teams being used to deal with mundane situations. In case you live out side the US, a SWAT (Special Weapons and Tactics) team is "a group of elite police marksmen who specialize in high-risk tasks". When most people hear SWAT, they think of bank robbers and terrorists. They are armed with military grade equipment and training. I have nothing against SWAT teams in principle; the problem is in practice. They are being called on to deal with situations local police could easily handle on their own. The results tend to be tragic.

Funny examples:
https://loweringthebar.net/2014/08/swat ... andma.html
https://loweringthebar.net/2014/10/a-fun-quiz.html

Serious example:
http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2017/0 ... story.html
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cphite
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Re: Unnecessary SWAT Use

Postby cphite » Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:42 pm UTC

In the third example, it's not SWAT that really caused the problem. The police were in a tough situation - they have a kid who they know is armed, barricaded, and who has already threatened to shoot someone. At that point they are obligated to stay until the situation is resolved. No matter how sure the parents are that this kid will just calm down if left alone, the police aren't allowed to take that chance. If they had left, and this kid had shot someone, either in the house or otherwise, they would be responsible for that. So they contained the situation and tried to talk him down. Unfortunately, that doesn't always work.

SWAT was called because there was the potential of a shootout in a residential area, with someone who is barricaded, and who is clearly not in a good frame of mind. If that were to happen, it isn't something your average local officer is equipped or even trained to handle. They didn't barge into the house or use any kind of force; they were there in case things got out of hand.

There are definitely examples of SWAT being overused; but frankly, in this case it sees appropriate based on the situation.

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LaserGuy
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Re: Unnecessary SWAT Use

Postby LaserGuy » Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:33 pm UTC

You can find numerous examples of this in the police misbehavior thread

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Ginger
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Re: Unnecessary SWAT Use

Postby Ginger » Tue Jan 23, 2018 10:55 am UTC

jewish_scientist wrote:I wanted to start this thread, because there seems to be a recent trend of SWAT teams being used to deal with mundane situations. In case you live out side the US, a SWAT (Special Weapons and Tactics) team is "a group of elite police marksmen who specialize in high-risk tasks".

SWAT forces, "elites w/guns and battering rams and armor," are NOT. NECESSARY. To deal w/... a single or two women w/guns, you can just send the regular cops, w/like partners for that. And when SWAT comes I bet there shall be properties damaged, people injured unnecessarily and even killed unnecessarily. And even if, like, you're a murderess w/severe anger issues threatening EVERYONE? MAYBE the cops should try TALKING before sending elite marksmen and women to KILL KILL people. SWAT is never justified w/how cops are using it these days and nights. AND they should be arrested and taken to court to confess that They disturbed the peace, They broke properties and injured INNOCENT CRIMINALS. And yes, criminals are always, forever, innocent when they don't injure the cops and the cops grievously injure or kill them via unnecessary deploying of SWAT forces.
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CorruptUser
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Re: Unnecessary SWAT Use

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Jan 23, 2018 2:47 pm UTC

cphite wrote:If they had left, and this kid had shot someone, either in the house or otherwise, they would be responsible for that.


Morally responsible, possibly. Legally responsible, unfortunately no. It might have political fallout if that happened, though, because politics.

jewish_scientist
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Re: Unnecessary SWAT Use

Postby jewish_scientist » Thu Jan 25, 2018 2:26 pm UTC

Ginger wrote:And when SWAT comes I bet there shall be properties damaged, people injured unnecessarily and even killed unnecessarily. And even if, like, you're a murderess w/severe anger issues threatening EVERYONE? MAYBE the cops should try TALKING before sending elite marksmen and women to KILL KILL people.

To be fair, most modern SWAT teams are specially trained in talking people down. A SWAT member who wanted to become a hostage negotiator would not a huge amount of extra training.

SWAT is never justified w/how cops are using it these days and nights.

There are plenty of times where SWAT teams are the appropriate response. Basically, the purpose of SWAT's creation was to deal with any violent situation that is outside the bounds of what the standard police are capable of handling, so SWAT teams are (usually) the best chose when dealing with these situations.

And yes, criminals are always, forever, innocent when they don't injure the cops and the cops grievously injure or kill them via unnecessary deploying of SWAT forces.

Wait, whether or not the actions of a person is a crime in dependent on what police, an inherently reactionary institution, do in response to those actions? I think you used the term 'innocent criminals', which is an oxymoron, when you meant to say 'non-violent suspects'.
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Ginger
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Re: Unnecessary SWAT Use

Postby Ginger » Thu Jan 25, 2018 2:36 pm UTC

I didn't know like they do negotiations w/suspects too? Wow. Okay, so I guess I wrong about that? I wrong about that. And I know... they don't call out SWAT for every. thing. Just... I hear stories they use SWAT for minor crimes, or at least minor to me, and I could find articles if anyone wanna? Anyways... as a 'non-violent suspect' who has been HAIR PULLED AND SHOOK AROUND like a rag doll re: cops I think THEY SHOULD BE responsible for what some non-violent suspects are pretty much Forced to become violent in response to their actions. Especially if the cops are harshly interrogating you, threatening you or using physical forces to get you to comply to their twisted orders, or sending SWAT to kill kill, injure and maim suspects... non-violent and violent alike... w/o any Gray Areas or treating the suspects like real peoples.
Amy Lee wrote:Just what we all need... more lies about a world that never was and never will be.


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speising
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Re: Unnecessary SWAT Use

Postby speising » Thu Jan 25, 2018 2:51 pm UTC

That's why i love the Canadian TV series Flashpoint.
It's about a SWAT team, but they rarely fire even a single shot, and it's a huge deal, a fail, if they have to.

But that's Canada of course...

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CorruptUser
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Re: Unnecessary SWAT Use

Postby CorruptUser » Thu Jan 25, 2018 2:53 pm UTC

That's just propaganda. We all know that the flag of Canada is a blood soaked field with the sword of 9 blades in the middle.

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Soupspoon
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Re: Unnecessary SWAT Use

Postby Soupspoon » Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:07 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:That's just propaganda. We all know that the flag of Canada is a blood soaked field with the sword of 9 blades in the middle.

Canadians imbibe the boiled blood of their own trees. If that doesn't indicate something not quite right about them, what would?


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